Sorry you are still having this problem. There are only a few people here who regularly reply to questions. You may need to ask in a busier place, like keyboardforums.com, or somewhere on reddit.

I don't own any midi hardware, so there's not much I can contribute this time around. I hope you are able to find a solution.

I am still looking for a miracle solution.

I tried with the module "Retrokits RK 006" but unfortunately it did not solve my problem.

Do you think that a Windows 7 would be a solution?

An external clock for external sequencer?

I don't understand, I'm not the only one with an Arturia Beatstep or a Nektar Aruba under windows 11? how do the others do it? am I stupid?

Help me

Merci

Dear Geoff,

Thank you very much for your investment in my annoying problem.

After reading the negative reviews about the Beatstep, I bought the NEKTAR AURA thinking that it would solve the problem ... and no ... bad move ...

Didier,

I was trying to find some info about your BeatStep device, and Google took me to Amazon, and the reviews from people who'd bought one.

Some were positive, but didn't say a lot about HOW.

Others were somewhat, or even VERY negative, and described in detail some of the problems that they'd had trying to get the device to work with their other devices. Some seemed to be similar problems to the problems you'd had. Insofar as I can tell from the details you've given.

The general conclusion I get is that the device will work with some other things/software, but not with others. I don't think Reason was mentioned?

You might have a look at some of the comments (there are some in French), and see if anything there helps you.

Geoff

Hello,

Unfortunately I can't change this parameter in Reason, but I must be the only one in the world to use a BEATSTEP and REASON... This is a crazy thing, especially since I've read a few forums about ticks, and frankly it's very mathematical :-D Thanks for your help

Didier - I've had a look at the two discussions you quote, and I understand SOME of it.

From this, I note that the 15360 is a normal setting within a DAW where you are dealing wih digital music as well as midi, and need to tie the two together, but seems that 15360 is serious overkill for midi alone.

Reaper is mentioned as having the ability to reduce this setting when exporting data to a midi file. No mention of Reason? Seems to suggest that 15630 will cause problems in a midi file. Some systems may be able to cope with this, some might not. If you go to midi alone, reduce this setting to 480 or 960.

Geoff

Jason,

That's a thought. As you know, if you've been following this, I've been moaning about the 'resolution' for a while. I suspect that the resolution used here is quite pointless. It's many times more than I've seen before. If something in Didier's system is having to round it, then it could be losing some ticks, and this could well be is a seemingly random way. I'd have to try some maths with the numbers, to see what happens.

Didier - this setting is just a midi command, at the start of the file in the Header chunk: MThd. This may be something that is set by the software, and I'm sure there must be something in the software that sets it. Midi files that I've seen are often 240, 480, even 960. Could be 1920, not sure if I've seen that. 15360 is a number of steps over (if the number can double each step). Once the file has been created, and BEFORE any data is put into it, this number must be changed, once data is added to the file then it's too late (normally) although some software MAY be able to change this resolution after the event (Sekuji). Note, this software complained about this setting, and changed it regardless.

Just done a quick calc. A resolution of 960 is usually quite enough for most purposes, double up 4 times from that and we get to 15360.

Remember, this is ticks per quarter note.

The midi file spec does not say what range of values is appropriate, but the value used in the example is 96.

As computers have got more powerful, and faster, the 'normal' value here has gone up. Even so, I'd think that 1920 was 'high'.

I'll have to see what I can find out about this.

Geoff

Thanks for your answer.

I don't think I can change this setting in Reason. According to your analysis, I searched on Google, and it becomes too technical for me :_-D
https://forum.reasontalk.com/viewtopic.php?t=7519886
https://forums.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=177778


In link an image of Reason parameters... Thanks for your help and patience

Quoted from Didier on Thursday, 02 February 2023

I have a 1/4 kick playing normally and I want to add exactly the same kick played with my sequencer. but this last one always plays with a little delay and always at a random time. so not in sync. so, the sequencing if it is not perfectly in sync, I cannot do anything with it.

Ahh, so with this wording here, I now understand the problem. I don't have a solution, but I am putting a screenshot for clarification.

Geoff, this is the event list from Sekiju (Note On only) of one of the sample files posted. The "Kong Hit" is coming from the DAW, and the "Hip Hop Kit" is coming from the external device. The Kong Hit is always precise, the Hip Hop Kit drifts.
Didier expects these to be synchronized, but they are not. Additionally, the sync difference fluctuates anywhere from 13 to 26 ticks (at least in Sekaiju, where it automatically adjusted the resolution down to 1920, as it is "too high").

I'm curious if it is in fact the resolution causing the problem.

Didier, are there any settings in the DAW or hardware for adjusting the resolution from 15360 down to 1920 TQPN (ticks per quarter note)?

It's clearly the computer/windows the problem. I'm going to try one of those USB HOST boxes, and we'll see if it doesn't work, I'm returning everything. My problem doesn't even need a picture to understand it.

I have a 1/4 kick playing normally and I want to add exactly the same kick played with my sequencer. but this last one always plays with a little delay and always at a random time. so not in sync. so, the sequencing if it is not perfectly in sync, I cannot do anything with it.

Again, you attach an image that does not help.

If such an image contained all the relevant data at that point in the midi music, i.e. data that would be on other tracks, using other channels, then this might tell something. Some data may be OK, other data may have been delayed (by what - WinDoze?) but it's not certain. Midi files you send seem to be OK, then I find that you've actually Quantized these!! Or part?

I'm not sure that using some sort of 'midi clock' will help. This depends on - does one of your devices generate a midi clock that CAN be sent to another device such that the second device will allow it's timing to be slaved to the first device. Some devices CAN do this, others do not. Even with such, you may STILL have a problem with 'latency', and the problem could yet be nothing to do with the 'drum' machines, this may be happening after them, maybe even within the computer, and I don't think THAT can be controlled by anything else?

Geoff

Here is a picture of a note that should always be played at the same time and wedged on the left line.

I made 5 times the same recording, that is to say a kick 1/4. We can see that the note is always played at a different time.

Anyway, I think I'll stop here.

Thanks for your help

Sorry, I don't know what you mean. 'Dane the mp3' does not mean anything to me.

An mp3 is an audio file, it just plays the sound that's there. I hear ONLY the 17 beats, I don't hear anything else. All the beats sound the same, it sounds like a piano beat, not a drum, but that doesn't mean anything. There is no hint of anything else playing, unless every note is in fact two notes played together, and they all sound the same.

Geoff

Dane the mp3

there are 2 sounds for each mp3

The 1st one (kick) generated at 125bpm --1/4 The 2nd one generated by the Beatstep --- sync slave -- each sound is a little bit off from the 1st one, and not always at the exact same offset ... is it me who has a too fine hearing... I doubt it.

The other one is normal because it has been quantized

Regarding the .mp3 file, I've just listened to it, twice.

No, I don't notice that it changes tempo. Just seems to me to be 12 or so regular beats. If it does change tempo, it's so slight that I cannot tell.

Just to pin it down, at what point does the change happen. i.e. at about beat nn?

I accept that you're having a problem of some sort, the question is what, what might be causing it, and how might it be fixed. I cannot do much (or even anything) from an audio file, whereas a midi file could offer some big clues.

The .csv file contains very little actual midi data, not at all sure what the point of this is?

Edit:

Listened again. No, no change of tempo.

I hear 17 beats, the file len is 12 secs. At what beat do you hear a change of tempo. Does it speed up, or slow down?

Maybe your computer is doing something funny, so you hear a change of tempo, but I do not. If this is so, it could explain a LOT

Geoff

I send you 2 .mid files (made by exporting from reason)

The first one is the result of the live recording with the Beatstep Sequencer. The second one is the same one once you have quantized.

Unfortunately I can't be more precise. But I'll try with ableton to see if the problem doesn't come from Reason

Edit :

Here is an mp3 file of a recording made with FL Studio.

Only 1/4 with the sequencer ... you can notice that the rhythm changes tempo or am I crazy ?

OK?

But I don't see anything wrong with the midi files. SHOULD I see something wrong there?

What is different with what you did to get the later image (which DOES show a problem) compared to what you did to get the midi files that seem to be OK?

Geoff

The .mid files are the recordings made in 2 different versions. The image comes from a new realization.

Didier,

Yes, I agree, the image shows a non-sync situation. Do you have a midi recording of this??

So what are you showing in the midi files you've recently sent? If you're showing two clearly different things, then this is not helping explain anything.

If some of the midi data has already been quantized, then this is what the police would call 'tampering with the evidence' so it becomes useless. You agree?

What happens if you get a midi file containing the 'recorded' track, NOT Quantized, with the live track, as live?

If these are then both 'wrong', but in sync, this might be a step towards getting an answer re 'What is happening?' If they are both 'wrong', and NOT in sync, then ....???

Geoff

The photo is still speaking, right?

here is another picture .

The 2 tracks were played with the Beatstep at the same rate. the top track was afterwards, quantified to stick perfectly. but impossible to quantify in LIVE. so when I play with my sequencer.. the result is desynchro so useless for what I wanted to do